Thread: Connection cables between amp and SACD player

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Post by Euell Neverno September 22, 2011 (51 of 70)
rammiepie said:

The very BEST sound from my system doesn't come from HDMI (hardly) but via analogue interconnects from my Marantz SA112s and my Meridian 800 via three proprietary coax interconnects directly into my Meridian 861 V.6........NO EQ of any sort.

For Blu~Ray, HDMI is mandatory unless one wants to "fuss" with VERY expensive component interconnects (some costing just under $1000) but for pure music from my various Oppos and Sony 5400ES, in my mind the verdict is out that an under $100 HDMI cable is not the sonic solution I had in mind!

And anyone who has been keeping up with the various Oppos and "modded" 5400 ES should be well aware that these units DO SOUND BETTER via their analogue outs.

So if analogue is dead or gasping for its last breath, that's the biggest crock of sh*t I've EVER heard....PERIOD!

Wake up people: FACTS ARE FACTS.........

A lot of us are spending $50~$70 for a single SACD so why scrimp on the lifeforce that carries the signal from your player to your pre~amp........Just doesn't make a lick of sense!

Hmm, and didn't we see the first digital equalizers in kids' boom boxes?

Post by rammiepie September 22, 2011 (52 of 70)
In the latest issue of Stereophile there is a discussion that the LISTENING ROOM accounts for approximately 50% of the sound one will conceivably hear from their respective audio systems......and goes on to say that very FEW of us are "blessed" with a perfectly suitable room environment in which to play our music.

So we can use our pre~amp's built in EQ (such as Audyssey), use various sound re~enforcing devices (room tunes, Shakti Holograms, etc) to help "focus" the sound and alternately "tame" the room or rely on Equalizers to accomplish what we think we want to ultimately hear.

But in the end, a set of well~honed EARS and a little bit of blood, sweat and yes, tears should be the deciding factor.

I have had tremendous success with Shakti~holograms and the less expensive room tunes to "tame" what I considered a horrendous room ......a basement with low ceilings and concrete floors.

I would never put an equalizer in the equation but run my system perfectly flat and after all this muss and fuss have what I consider a pretty high quality system.

There is always room for improvement and I'm always experimenting with cabling, etc., but I must say, I'm quite happy with the results (but my bank account, isn't, of course)!

Post by Euell Neverno September 22, 2011 (53 of 70)
Fitzcaraldo215 said:

That would be true of passive line stages, but not necessarily of active ones, which can also introduce gain to the signal. But, it's a moot point.
.

While active preamps do indeed provide signal gain, the gain is supplied ahead of the volume control, which acts to attenuate the signal supplied by the gain stages.

Post by stvnharr September 22, 2011 (54 of 70)
Pardon me for interrupting this, but there are too many errors here concerning gain, volume control and signal attenuation.

In a passive unit, there is no applied voltage/electricity and NO gain period. There is attenuation of the signal voltage, usually by a voltage divider circuit shunting some of the voltage to ground with a stepped attenuator or potentiometer. There are also transformer based attenuators, commonly called TVC's, which have recently found favor with some. There a couple of other ways of doing it, but the above covers most applications.

In most all non passive preamps, which is most preamps, the circuitry is as follows: signal level control by an attenuator or potentiometer, which is then followed by a gain stage circuit. The two are separate parts of the unit. Gain is set by the ratio of resistors in the circuit topology going from +v to -v in the circuit. Gain is a fixed item determined by a formula.
As always there are exceptions, and there are a few preamps that have switchable gain settings, say 3db or 6db. I have even heard once of a design that had a variable gain circuit. And I also know of a preamp with the attenuation between the gain stage and buffer, but only one.

Also, gain stages are not confined to just preamps. There can be small gain stages in player output circuitries, and there is always a rather large gain stage at the input in power amplifiers.

Post by val242 September 22, 2011 (55 of 70)
I think so "...those that say that cables should not make a difference, are dead right." Read full from this

http://www.audioholics.com/education/cables/cable-distortion-and-dielectric-biasing-debunked

Post by hiredfox September 23, 2011 (56 of 70)
stvnharr said:

Pardon me for interrupting this, but there are too many errors here concerning gain, volume control and signal attenuation.

Yes.... ?

In fact "pre-amplifier" is a misnomer because if you only compare what comes out with what goes in even active line units are also attenuators.

This point has been made frequently in audiophile circles since CD came along but the industry is fixated on vinyl and valves so of course they always see that first box as an 'amplifier' but for most of us they are attenuators.

Post by stvnharr September 23, 2011 (57 of 70)
hiredfox said:

Yes.... ?

In fact "pre-amplifier" is a misnomer because if you only compare what comes out with what goes in even active line units are also attenuators.

This point has been made frequently in audiophile circles since CD came along but the industry is fixated on vinyl and valves so of course they always see that first box as an 'amplifier' but for most of us they are attenuators.

I don't really want my comments to redirect this discussion to one of preamps. I just wanted to correct some errors that I saw in regards the terms gain, signal attenuation and volume control.

Post by rammiepie September 23, 2011 (58 of 70)
stvnharr said:

Hmm, it matters little what you call a box.
It only matters what happens inside the box.

And outside the box, as well.

Systems are synergistic and each piece in the chain as well as the interconnects are tantamount to the whole.

And since the listening environment is one's own private concert hall and accounts for 50% of the final outcome it had better be ready for it's close~up or all that fancy equipment is moot!

Post by stvnharr September 23, 2011 (59 of 70)
rammiepie said:

And outside the box, as well.

Systems are synergistic and each piece in the chain as well as the interconnects are tantamount to the whole.

And since the listening environment is one's own private concert hall and accounts for 50% of the final outcome it had better be ready for it's close~up or all that fancy equipment is moot!

This is relevant to what discussion? It certainly is not relevant to my two recent posts in this thread.

Post by rammiepie September 23, 2011 (60 of 70)
stvnharr said:

This is relevant to what discussion? It certainly is not relevant to my two recent posts in this thread.

This is relevant to the Chinese puzzle which this initial thread {posted by a "newby" named Lucifer} about connection cables between amp and SACD player has DEVOLVED into!

Care to solve it?

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